Go Back   Professional Soldiers ® > The Pipeline (Special Forces Training) > 18C

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes

What were we dealing with?
Old 03-20-2018, 13:32   #1
Cobwebs
Quiet Professional
 
Cobwebs's Avatar
 
Cobwebs is offline
Join Date: Dec 2010
Location: Michigan/Florida
Posts: 163
What were we dealing with?

Hopefully one of you 18C's can tell me what we found on the beach yesterday. A lady was doing one of her daily searches for sea shells and showed me something that resembled a half peeled orange maybe a half inch thick. It was very light coloured orange and very lumpy. My wife thought someone discarded part of an orange peel. The lady then broke it in half and it was a light cream color on the inside. Thinking it was nothing she then tossed it on the beach.

Now the interesting part. Within about a minute one of the pieces ignited by itself and burned like a flair with about a three inch flame. The lady picked it up with a metal scoop and put it in the ocean. Then the other one ignited and I buried it in the sand. She took the one out of the ocean and when she broke it in half again it reignited again. Took mine out of the sand and same thing. The air seemed to cause them to ignite. Being an old commo guy I got to experience C-4 and grenade simulators during training but this was new to me.. Thanks for any information.
  Reply With Quote

Old 03-21-2018, 08:00   #2
ElSeco
Asset
 
ElSeco is offline
Join Date: Mar 2018
Posts: 1
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cobwebs View Post
Hopefully one of you 18C's can tell me what we found on the beach yesterday. A lady was doing one of her daily searches for sea shells and showed me something that resembled a half peeled orange maybe a half inch thick. It was very light coloured orange and very lumpy. My wife thought someone discarded part of an orange peel. The lady then broke it in half and it was a light cream color on the inside. Thinking it was nothing she then tossed it on the beach.

Now the interesting part. Within about a minute one of the pieces ignited by itself and burned like a flair with about a three inch flame. The lady picked it up with a metal scoop and put it in the ocean. Then the other one ignited and I buried it in the sand. She took the one out of the ocean and when she broke it in half again it reignited again. Took mine out of the sand and same thing. The air seemed to cause them to ignite. Being an old commo guy I got to experience C-4 and grenade simulators during training but this was new to me.. Thanks for any information.
Sounds like you found some Willie Peter with a coating keeping it from contacting the oxygen in the air. If was WP would have produced a dense white smoke.
  Reply With Quote

Old 03-21-2018, 09:52   #3
JJ_BPK
Quiet Professional
 
JJ_BPK's Avatar
 
JJ_BPK is offline
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: NOVA
Posts: 9,339
There are only a couple elements and compounds that self-ignite on exposure to air.

But this sounds like WP

Quote:
White Phosphorus - SourceWatch
https://www.sourcewatch.org/index.php/White_Phosphorus

Examples of these items are white phosphorus (WP), white phosphorus plasticized (PWP), or other ammunition containing pyrophoric material." Group H materials may ... Water will put out white phosphorus temporarily, but as soon as the phosphorus has access to air, it will start burning again. White phosphorus wounds ...

STRONGLY SUGGEST you contact local FBI & LEO's
This could be "parts" of a larger pile of WP munitions and could become dangerous to anyone in contact.
__________________
Go raibh tú leathuair ar Neamh sula mbeadh a fhios ag an diabhal go bhfuil tú marbh

"May you be a half hour in heaven before the devil knows you’re dead"
  Reply With Quote

Old 03-21-2018, 10:11   #4
RichL025
Quiet Professional
 
RichL025 is offline
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: Asscrackistan
Posts: 373
If it was WP it would have still been burning when the lady chucked her part back in the water, wouldn't it?

All the same, I agree with contacting the cops.

Edit: Sorry I should have read JJ's post a little closer. Now I recall I was wrong above about the water....
__________________
Ars Longa, vita brevis
  Reply With Quote

Old 03-21-2018, 10:55   #5
JJ_BPK
Quiet Professional
 
JJ_BPK's Avatar
 
JJ_BPK is offline
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: NOVA
Posts: 9,339
WP store in water (better to just avoid)

You must keep Li, Na, K, Rb, Cs way from water as they actively react with the water; water is always present in the air, So metallic Sodium must be stored covered in an anhydrous solvent (aka kerosene)

Attached Images
File Type: jpg element table.jpg (29.2 KB, 23 views)
__________________
Go raibh tú leathuair ar Neamh sula mbeadh a fhios ag an diabhal go bhfuil tú marbh

"May you be a half hour in heaven before the devil knows you’re dead"
  Reply With Quote

Old 03-21-2018, 13:32   #6
Cobwebs
Quiet Professional
 
Cobwebs's Avatar
 
Cobwebs is offline
Join Date: Dec 2010
Location: Michigan/Florida
Posts: 163
Thanks for getting back to me...I had a feeling it may of been military grade. Will contact the police asap.
  Reply With Quote

Old 03-21-2018, 13:33   #7
7624U
Quiet Professional
 
7624U's Avatar
 
7624U is offline
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Destination Unknown
Posts: 781
I would agree with JJ_BPK it was metallic sodium that had a coating on it. When exposed to moist conditions started burning, Sodium has a yellowish smoke and yellow flame, If it was bright white flame then it was most-likely something different like WP.
__________________
"Always listen to experts. They'll tell you what can't be done, and why. Then do it.”

"Robert A. Heinlein"

Last edited by 7624U; 03-21-2018 at 13:35.
  Reply With Quote

Old 03-21-2018, 13:45   #8
JJ_BPK
Quiet Professional
 
JJ_BPK's Avatar
 
JJ_BPK is offline
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: NOVA
Posts: 9,339
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cobwebs View Post
Thanks for getting back to me...I had a feeling it may of been military grade. Will contact the police asap.
Where did this happen?
__________________
Go raibh tú leathuair ar Neamh sula mbeadh a fhios ag an diabhal go bhfuil tú marbh

"May you be a half hour in heaven before the devil knows you’re dead"
  Reply With Quote

Old 03-21-2018, 15:00   #9
Cobwebs
Quiet Professional
 
Cobwebs's Avatar
 
Cobwebs is offline
Join Date: Dec 2010
Location: Michigan/Florida
Posts: 163
JJ we are in Jensen Beach, Fl. just down here doing the retirement thing...fishing..drinking...fishing...drinking...t hen smoke on the horizon...thanks again to all of you...will keep you updated on our progress...
  Reply With Quote

Old 03-21-2018, 17:08   #10
JJ_BPK
Quiet Professional
 
JJ_BPK's Avatar
 
JJ_BPK is offline
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: NOVA
Posts: 9,339
During WW II there were several Army Air Corp school/based from Jax South to Key West.

You may have found some ord that was dumped and should have landed in deep water.

I not familiar with that area, but in the South, they used tractors with field rakes to gather seaweed. One could have dug into a stash?

There were several German boats sunk along the coast. Could have had WP for signaling motars?

Here is a map, not all WWII. There are a bunch
Attached Images
File Type: jpg shpfl_forweb.jpg (84.1 KB, 32 views)
__________________
Go raibh tú leathuair ar Neamh sula mbeadh a fhios ag an diabhal go bhfuil tú marbh

"May you be a half hour in heaven before the devil knows you’re dead"
  Reply With Quote

Proximate to Jensen Beach
Old 03-21-2018, 18:50   #11
tonyz
Area Commander
 
tonyz is offline
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: USA
Posts: 3,845
Proximate to Jensen Beach

Interesting find and interesting article on the area below.

Had the honor of having lunch with an old frogman from this era - who trained in this area.

Florida's WWII training left untold hazards for oil speculators

Jim Waymer,
FLORIDA TODAY
Published 10:09 a.m. ET July 29, 2017 | Updated 4:04 p.m. ET July 30, 2017

Fort Pierce Naval Amphibious Training Base

The Fort Pierce Naval Amphibious Training Base was a 19,280.48-acre site that extended approximately 25 miles from near Vero Beach to near Jensen Beach and included North and South Hutchinson Islands. The Navy constructed more than 450 buildings at the training site.

https://www.floridatoday.com/story/n...ors/505158001/
__________________
The function of wisdom is to discriminate between good and evil.

Marcus Tullius Cicero
  Reply With Quote

Old 03-21-2018, 19:53   #12
CSB
Quiet Professional
 
CSB's Avatar
 
CSB is offline
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Clarksville, TN
Posts: 1,035
At one time it was not unusual to take outdated or surplus munitions out to sea and dump them.
Coastal charts still have warning areas marked, where sailors are directed NOT to drop anchor, bottom troll or drag.
Of course, simply dropping it overboard does not make it evaporate.
I concur with WP, but again the dense white smoke is the key indicator.
Attached Images
File Type: jpg 3+08+D+Details+from+the+NOAA+chart+of+San+Diego.jpg (344.7 KB, 28 views)
  Reply With Quote

Old 03-21-2018, 23:15   #13
RichL025
Quiet Professional
 
RichL025 is offline
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: Asscrackistan
Posts: 373
Quote:
Originally Posted by 7624U View Post
I would agree with JJ_BPK it was metallic sodium that had a coating on it. When exposed to moist conditions started burning, Sodium has a yellowish smoke and yellow flame, ...
No, if it was elemental sodium or potassium, the burning would have continued (and actually gotten worse) when she chucked it in the water. You can find videos of people doing that on *******, it's pretty impressive.
__________________
Ars Longa, vita brevis
  Reply With Quote

WP
Old 03-22-2018, 13:17   #14
Cobwebs
Quiet Professional
 
Cobwebs's Avatar
 
Cobwebs is offline
Join Date: Dec 2010
Location: Michigan/Florida
Posts: 163
WP

Just finished meeting with our local Sheriff. Like many of you have alluded to the training site in Ft. Pierce has indeed left a plethora of unused ordnance that the local population has been dealing with lately. As shells deteriorate ordnance has increasingly appeared on our shores.

Thanks again to all of you for your timely responses. On side note sorry I failed to mention the smoke was indeed dense and white. A friend of mine has some pictures that he has that I will put on when I get them.
  Reply With Quote

Old 03-22-2018, 17:28   #15
tonyz
Area Commander
 
tonyz is offline
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: USA
Posts: 3,845
CW, you did the right thing reporting that find. Given your description, the find’s proximity to the old Fort Pierce Naval Amphibious Training Base and the use of WP in WWII...better safe than sorry.

See 2017 article below describing a similar find on a beach in Germany.

German woman picks up WW2 white phosphorus bomb after mistaking it for amber

Walker on banks of River Elbe near Hamburg put the object in the pocket of her jacket which later burst into flames


Jeff Farrell Sunday 6 August 2017 09:38 BST

UK Independent

A woman in Germany narrowly avoided injury after she picked up a shiny object on a beach she believed to be amber, but which turned out to be part of a Second World War bomb that later burst into flames.

The 41-year-old was out walking on the banks of the Elbe river near Hamburg when she plucked the small stone-like item from wet sand and put it in the pocket of her jacket.

But the souvenir turned out to be a centimetre-long chunk of white phosphorus – which ignited just moments later in the incident near the town of Wedel.

<snip>

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/w...-a7879121.html
__________________
The function of wisdom is to discriminate between good and evil.

Marcus Tullius Cicero
  Reply With Quote
Reply


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is Off
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump



All times are GMT -6. The time now is 03:23.



Copyright 2004-2017 by Professional Soldiers ®
Site Designed, Maintained, & Hosted by Hilliker Technologies