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Old 04-16-2011, 21:02   #16
The Reaper
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Iraqgunz View Post
Are you referring to the USSOCOM testing? In your honesty opinion do you htink that this round is truly worthwhile? Just curious because there is very little information out there about it.
AFAIK, USSOCOM has never shot live tissue in ammunition testing. They seem to prefer Jell-O.

You might try the Search button here for LeMas info.

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Old 04-17-2011, 12:52   #17
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IraqGunz - here's a good thread / bit of info on LeMas.

http://www.professionalsoldiers.com/...ighlight=lamas
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Old 04-17-2011, 16:00   #18
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Actually I did read that a while back. I just haven't been able to find any new(er) stuff or too much more about it. I haven't seen much in the internet world about it actually being issued and used except for a few departments.

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IraqGunz - here's a good thread / bit of info on LeMas.

http://www.professionalsoldiers.com/...ighlight=lamas
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Old 04-21-2011, 14:09   #19
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The .223 Round

Just two words:.......SHOT PLACEMENT.......tom kelly and of course trigger control, no spray & pray, Last but not least, TAKE LESSONS, from a competent instructor, Preferably one who has been in combat & on the receiving end of hostile fire. e g Paul Howe conducts a very professional instructional course on this subject...use the search button, sign up, pay the required fee. and Listen and Learn. You; may think it is expensive to attend this course in Texas, But what is your life worth? TK out.
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Old 04-30-2011, 21:03   #20
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During most of the 1980's, and all of 1990, I was a Customs Special Agent, and a member of SRT, once established at Fort Benning. Circa 1990 our Agency was involved in a warrant execution near San Diego, in conjunction with DEA. At the time, Customs issued long guns were Styer Augs (.223). DEA's were Colt SMG's (9mm). Upon execution of the warrant, the occupant immediately initiated fire on the Agents, who, naturallly, responded in kind.

I don't recall the total nmber of rounds fired, and I wasn't there, but I know I was advised that all of the 9mm (147 gr. W.W. Silvertip) rounds fired by DEA Agents totally penetrated every interior and exterior wall they were directed at, while none of the .223's fired by Customs Agents exited the structure at all. At the time, we were using .40 gr. HP's, but I can't recall the manufacturer.

EPILOGUE:

The occupant was eventually hit in the femoral artery with a .45 round fired from a Sig P-220 by the Customs Agent (whom I'd known since the Border Patrol Academy) telling me the story, thereby ending the dispute (temporarily). On scene paramedics were able to revive the subject, and he recovered to sue the Government, and make a segment of 60 minutes, as DEA's informant had signifigant "issues," AND, . . . it was the wrong house.

"There endeth the lesson(s)" - which are multiple.
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Old 03-16-2013, 10:34   #21
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These guys do a lot of testing.

http://www.theboxotruth.com/docs/bot4.htm

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Old 03-16-2013, 13:50   #22
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Originally Posted by Broadsword2004 View Post
So I just want to be clear here, but if I have a 9mm handgun and fire it at a wall, it would likely penetrate the wall moreso than a .223 fired from an AR-15?
Based on my experience with 9x19 and 5.56x45 Ball , yes.

Any of the M193 or lighter, high-velocity rounds should come apart pretty quickly in construction materials.

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Old 03-16-2013, 16:15   #23
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Originally Posted by alelks View Post
These guys do a lot of testing.

http://www.theboxotruth.com/docs/bot4.htm

LOL, I love his last comment:

Moral of this lesson:
Don't get in any gun fights with buffalo hunters. There ain't no such thing as cover.
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Old 03-16-2013, 16:45   #24
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Don't get in any gun fights with buffalo hunters. There ain't no such thing as cover.
Did someone say Beowulf?
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Old 03-16-2013, 18:45   #25
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Team Sergeant View Post
LOL, I love his last comment:

Moral of this lesson:
Don't get in any gun fights with buffalo hunters. There ain't no such thing as cover.
And that's why I have a 308 Larue instead of a 5.56.

Why go through the door when you can shoot through the walls?

Last edited by alelks; 03-16-2013 at 18:48.
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Old 03-22-2013, 23:39   #26
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Broadsword2004 View Post
I think I had read or watched something like this regarding armored vehicles, regarding vehicles armored to withstand weapons like AR-15s, where they'll have say two layers of armor, spaced apart at certain areas, so if the projectile does manage to penetrate the first layer, if it's the type that loses energy quickly, the second layer will stop it.
That concept applies to much larger projectiles, too.
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