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Old 03-25-2008, 10:12   #1
Defender968
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Sister Service Officers as 18As

I've recently become aware of a few sister service officers (specifically AF and Navy) who are in the process of going through the Q. While I would guess this would be a fairly unusual occurrence I'm curious to see what experiences they've had both in the course and after it, (specifically dealing with their background and the challenges or benefits it presented) if any are willing to share. I'd also like to know what experiences any of the QPs have had in serving with detachment commanders who came from either the AF or the Navy, good or bad.

Thanks
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Old 03-25-2008, 14:32   #2
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The Navy has always sent SEALS to the Q course. We had one in my class in 1980. Super guy as well.
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Old 03-25-2008, 14:51   #3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Defender968 View Post
I've recently become aware of a few sister service officers (specifically AF and Navy) who are in the process of going through the Q. While I would guess this would be a fairly unusual occurrence I'm curious to see what experiences they've had both in the course and after it, (specifically dealing with their background and the challenges or benefits it presented) if any are willing to share. I'd also like to know what experiences any of the QPs have had in serving with detachment commanders who came from either the AF or the Navy, good or bad.

Thanks
I take it that you are referring to O's that do an inter service transfer to the Army.
I have Known several enlisted that jumped to the army for SF as enlisted and some as O's. They came with other outlooks and experiences that contributed to the teams capability. That is what makes a team unique. You really need that regular military experience to draw from to enhance the mission.
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Old 03-25-2008, 18:17   #4
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Originally Posted by SF_BHT View Post
I take it that you are referring to O's that do an inter service transfer to the Army.
I have Known several enlisted that jumped to the army for SF as enlisted and some as O's. They came with other outlooks and experiences that contributed to the teams capability. That is what makes a team unique. You really need that regular military experience to draw from to enhance the mission.
Im reading what youre saying SF_BHT, the different experiences can be good for the teams, and the regular AF/NAVY/ARMY/MARINE experience gives you something to draw from, a base line.

If I can SF_BHT, can I ask how you would view an O from another service if he showed up on your team? Would it make a difference to you, or would it simply depend on how he performs while hes there?

I know that interservice transfers have always happened at the enlisted level, but I have not found much in terms of accounts of it happening on the officer side, not to say it is happening more now or didn't happen before, but I've read on this board and elsewhere about AF officers applying but not much of any making it. I simply wanted to get first hand information if possible. (Im not asking if its possible I know it is, I was simply curious as to the experiences of those who have done it, or experienced those who have)

As for the different experiences, I would think the experience Navy SEAL officers, AF CROs or STOs would have would be very applicable. What I'm more curious about is the experience from the regular AF or Navy officers.
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Old 03-25-2008, 18:43   #5
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Originally Posted by Defender968 View Post
As for the different experiences, I would think the experience Navy SEAL officers, AF CROs or STOs would have would be very applicable. .
And how do you draw that conclusion? What exactly do you think that these folks have that would make them anymore desireable than anyone else?
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Old 03-25-2008, 19:52   #6
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Originally Posted by Defender968 View Post
Im reading what youre saying SF_BHT, the different experiences can be good for the teams, and the regular AF/NAVY/ARMY/MARINE experience gives you something to draw from, a base line.

If I can SF_BHT, can I ask how you would view an O from another service if he showed up on your team? Would it make a difference to you, or would it simply depend on how he performs while hes there?

I know that interservice transfers have always happened at the enlisted level, but I have not found much in terms of accounts of it happening on the officer side, not to say it is happening more now or didn't happen before, but I've read on this board and elsewhere about AF officers applying but not much of any making it. I simply wanted to get first hand information if possible. (Im not asking if its possible I know it is, I was simply curious as to the experiences of those who have done it, or experienced those who have)

As for the different experiences, I would think the experience Navy SEAL officers, AF CROs or STOs would have would be very applicable. What I'm more curious about is the experience from the regular AF or Navy officers.
Never saw a Navy or AF officer make it into the program, or even try.

Several Marines did, and succeeded.

TR
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Old 03-25-2008, 21:23   #7
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I know of two...

...and are both former Navy Officers who came from the SWCC community. One is currently serving in 10th Group and the other in 3rd I believe... They were in my SFAS class.

As memory serves me they were both well received by their class mates but I dont have any real feedback as to how they fit in on a team. I would imagine, like with anyone else on a team, they were judged by what they brought to the team not where they came from.

I also know of an AF Officer but dont have any real useful information on him as he is still in the course.

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Old 03-26-2008, 07:30   #8
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Originally Posted by Defender968 View Post
I’m reading what you’re saying SF_BHT, the different experiences can be good for the teams, and the regular AF/NAVY/ARMY/MARINE experience gives you something to draw from, a base line.

If I can SF_BHT, can I ask how you would view an O from another service if he showed up on your team? Would it make a difference to you, or would it simply depend on how he performs while he’s there?
I know that interservice transfers have always happened at the enlisted level, but I have not found much in terms of accounts of it happening on the officer side, not to say it is happening more now or didn't happen before, but I've read on this board and elsewhere about AF officers applying but not much of any making it. I simply wanted to get first hand information if possible. (I’m not asking if it’s possible I know it is, I was simply curious as to the experiences of those who have done it, or experienced those who have)

As for the different experiences, I would think the experience Navy SEAL officers, AF CROs or STOs would have would be very applicable. What I'm more curious about is the experience from the regular AF or Navy officers.
No sister service officers have ever commanded a A-Team to my knowledge in an exchange program while still serving in the AF or Navy.

As Surgicalcric noted some have branch transfered and are currently serving as Army officers in SF.

As the Good Col Noted "What exactly do you think that these folks have that would make them anymore desirable than anyone else? " Nothing They only would bring unique Navy or AF experiences to the job.
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Old 03-26-2008, 08:05   #9
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I'd be interested if anyone believes that an increased/streamlined service-crossover option (at the extreme, making USSF a standing joint unit with a steady flow of applicants from all services) would be a smarter move than trying to raise MARSOC from scratch to take up some of the FID mission?
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Old 03-26-2008, 08:25   #10
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I was an O-3 in the Navy with 7 years commissioned service when I dropped my commission and enlisted in 20th group. My warfare specialty in the Navy was SWO (Surface Warfare Officer), which did not readily transfer over to the Army. I was told that if I wanted to become an 18A, I could either get my tab and then accept a commission when my first enlistment was over (after attending the Captain's Career Course and Phases III and IV), or come over as an infantry officer and after attending the requisite schools and serving in an infantry unit attend SFAS. I chose instead to go the Q as a SGT and become an 18E. Having seen both sides of the coin, I think that a successful officer in a sister service will probably be a successful officer in the SF community. However, the cultural differences between the Navy or Air Force and the Army are as profound as those between the U.S. Army and another country's service. With these cultural differences and the numerous practical skill-sets that a inter-service transfer would be missing, it would be an extremely steep learning curve in both the Q and on a team. I do think that good leadership transcends service affiliation.
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Old 03-26-2008, 08:44   #11
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[QUOTE=Falstaff;204062] I do think that good leadership transcends service affiliation.[/QUOT

I agree in principle, however leadership styles for a successful 18A do not necessarily transcend service concepts of leadership. The caliber, expectations, skill sets, and demands of A-Team troops and beyond are a lot different, with some exceptions, than what you are likely to find elsewhere.
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Old 03-26-2008, 09:08   #12
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I agree in principle, however leadership styles for a successful 18A do not necessarily transcend service concepts of leadership. The caliber, expectations, skill sets, and demands of A-Team troops and beyond are a lot different, with some exceptions, than what you are likely to find elsewhere.
Absolutely.

I have even heard of occasional Merchant Marine grads going on to distinguished careers as SF officers.

TR
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Old 03-26-2008, 21:16   #13
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First let me apologize, I think I should have titled this thread Prior Sister Service Officers as 18As.

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And how do you draw that conclusion? What exactly do you think that these folks have that would make them anymore desirable than anyone else?
Sir I believe I completely failed to accurately communicate. I don't think that an officer from either the AF or NAVY would be more desirable than an Army officer at all, especially one with infantry experience, quite the contrary I think that either an AF or NAVY officer would be quite a bit behind the power curve, but possibly not too much further behind than say an Army Acquisitions officer in some ways. What I meant but failed to accurately convey by my earlier statement was that I would think that the experience a SEAL officer, or an AF CRO/STO would possess would be much more relevant than that of a line Navy or AF officer, I sincerely apologize if that came across wrong. I in no way think an AF or NAVY officer would make a better candidate to become an 18A than anyone else.

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Originally Posted by SF_BHT View Post
No sister service officers have ever commanded a A-Team to my knowledge in an exchange program while still serving in the AF or Navy.
As Surgicalcric noted some have branch transfered and are currently serving as Army officers in SF.

As the Good Col Noted "What exactly do you think that these folks have that would make them anymore desirable than anyone else? " Nothing They only would bring unique Navy or AF experiences to the job.
I apologize again for failing to be clear, what I meant was a former AF/NAVY officer who had gone through an interserivce transfer and branch transferred to SF, not an exchange program of any type. I was seeking input from exactly those officers that Surgicalcric speaks of, a prior AF/NAVY type that made it through the interservice transfer process and successfully through SFAS, the 18A course, the Q, and to a team. The question I was trying to ask SF_BHT was how you would feel about a prior AF/NAVY officer who had made it into SF after coming through the interservice transfer route.

Again I meant no offense, I simply had been given information from a recruiter that sister service officers were able to go through an interserivce transfer and then attend SFAS and go on into the pipeline to become an 18A and I wanted to touch base with someone who had actually done it if possible.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Falstaff View Post
I was an O-3 in the Navy with 7 years commissioned service when I dropped my commission and enlisted in 20th group. My warfare specialty in the Navy was SWO (Surface Warfare Officer), which did not readily transfer over to the Army. I was told that if I wanted to become an 18A, I could either get my tab and then accept a commission when my first enlistment was over (after attending the Captain's Career Course and Phases III and IV), or come over as an infantry officer and after attending the requisite schools and serving in an infantry unit attend SFAS. I chose instead to go the Q as a SGT and become an 18E. Having seen both sides of the coin, I think that a successful officer in a sister service will probably be a successful officer in the SF community. However, the cultural differences between the Navy or Air Force and the Army are as profound as those between the U.S. Army and another country's service. With these cultural differences and the numerous practical skill-sets that a inter-service transfer would be missing, it would be an extremely steep learning curve in both the Q and on a team. I do think that good leadership transcends service affiliation.
Thanks Falstaff that is along the lines of what I was thinking in terms of the cultural differences between the AF/NAVY and Army, but without any firsthand knowledge to either prove or disprove my thought process.

Last edited by Defender968; 03-26-2008 at 21:19.
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Old 03-26-2008, 22:45   #14
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...I simply had been given information from a recruiter that sister service officers were able to go through an interservice transfer and then attend SFAS and go on into the pipeline to become an 18A....
When I attended SFAS in '05, and things could have changed since then, the officers attended SFAS first. If selected the O's were then interservice transferred to start the SFQC.

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Last edited by Surgicalcric; 03-26-2008 at 22:48.
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Old 03-28-2008, 06:11   #15
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Gentlemen,
I am an active duty Marine Corps officer. I completed SFAS last September. I owe the Corps one more year on my contract and then I will inter-service transfer into the Army as an infantry officer. Sequence of training will be as follows:
1. MCCC
2. Airborne
3. Q course
- MOS becomes 18A
4. Ranger

And then to group.
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