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Old 02-06-2007, 20:18   #16
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Old 02-06-2007, 21:42   #17
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Another sighting

I saw this quote when I was at Airborne School over last summer. Bravo Company's CQ desk had a copy of it, but no attribution to NDD.

-Derek
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Old 02-11-2007, 09:11   #18
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Corrected Blog

Hello, I'm Holly of Holly's Hystrionics.
I have just posted "True Believer" again. This time however, it is posted alone, not as part of a letter.
I have also noted, now that I am aware, that it is a copyrighted work; and have attributed it to PS according to NDD's wishes.
I hope that, since this was an unintentional error on my part and I have corrected it, you will return to my site as guests, friends, readers, instead of hostile lurkers. Can we start over? I'd like your take on the blog I wrote just before the original one y'all got upset about, it was about eco-friendly weapons. I got my shooter-readers opinions on it, how about some soldiers opinions, especialy on the hybrid tanks, and quiet bombs?


edit: I changed the font size to normal. Kyo
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Old 03-04-2007, 10:01   #19
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Some blogs,forums and newspapers are now publishing our quote as Henryk M. Broder writings.

Seems someone is twisting what Henryk M. Broder has published and added our PLAGIARIZED “True Believer” quote in his writing.

Also seems there are only three websites that use our plagiarized quote and they are:

http://blog.stevious.com/?m=200611

http://forums.sptimes.com/Forums/ubb...5&t=020319&p=1

http://www2.beaufortgazette.com/watc...become_islamic

"The German author Henryk M. Broder recently told the Dutch newspaper De Volkskrant (12 October) that young Europeans who love freedom, better emigrate.
Europe as we know it will no longer exist 20 years from now. Whilst sitting on a terrace in Berlin , Broder pointed to the other customers and the passers-by and said melancholically: "We are watching the world of yesterday."
Europe is turning Muslim. As Broder is sixty years old he is not going to emigrate himself. "I am too old," he said. However, he urged young people to
get out and "move to Australia or New Zealand.?� That is the only option they have if they want to avoid the plagues that will turn the old continent uninhabitable."
Many Germans and Dutch, apparently, did not wait for Broder's advice. The number of emigrants leaving the Netherlands and Germany has already surpassed the number of immigrants moving in. One does not have to be prophetic to predict, like Henryk Broder, that Europe is becoming Islamic. Just consider the demographics. The number of Muslims in contemporary Europe is estimated to be 50 million. It is expected to double in twenty years. By 2025, one third of all European children will be born to Muslim families. Today Mohammed is already the most popular name for new-born boys in Brussels, Amsterdam , Rotterdam, and other major European cities.
Boder is convinced that the Europeans are not willing to oppose islamization.
"The dominant ethos," he told De Volkskrant, "is perfectly voiced by the stupid blonde woman author with whom I recently debated. She said that it is sometimes better to let yourself be raped than to risk serious injuries while resisting.
She said it is sometimes better to avoid fighting than run the risk of death."
In a recent op-ed piece in the Brussels newspaper De Standaard (23 October) the Dutch (gay and self-declared "humanist") author Oscar Van den Boogaard refers to Broder's interview. Van den Boogaard says that to him coping with the islamization of Europe is like "a process of mourning." He is overwhelmed by a "feeling of sadness." "I am not a warrior," he says, "but who is? I have never learned to fight for my freedom. I was only good at enjoying it." As Tom Bethell wrote in this month's American Spectator: "Just at the most basic level
of demography the secular-humanist option is not working." But there is more to it than the fact that non-religious people tend not to have as many children as religious people, because many of them prefer to "enjoy" freedom rather than renounce it for the sake of children. Secularists, it seems to me, are also less keen on fighting. Since they do not believe in an afterlife, this life is the only thing they have to lose. Hence they will rather accept submission than fight. Like the German feminist Broder referred to, they
prefer to be raped than to resist.
"If faith collapses, civilization goes with it," says Bethell. That is the real cause of the closing of civilization in Europe. Islamization is simply the
consequence. The very word Islam means "submission" and the secularists have submitted already. Many Europeans have already become Muslims, though they do not realize it or do not want to admit it.
Some of the people I meet in the U.S. are particularly worried about the rise of anti-Semitism in Europe. They are correct when they fear that anti-Semitism is also on the rise among non-immigrant Europeans. The latter hate people with a fighting spirit. Contemporary anti-Semitism in Europe (at least when coming from native Europeans) is related to anti-Americanism. People who are not prepared to resist and are eager to submit, hate others who do not want to submit and are prepared to fight. They hate them because they are afraid that the latter will endanger their lives as well. In their view everyone must submit.
This is why they have come to hate Israel and America so much, and the small band of European "islamophobes" who dare to talk about what they see happening around them. West Europeans have to choose between submission (Islam) or death. I fear, like Broder, that they have chosen submission - just
like in former days when they preferred to be red rather than dead.
Americans, somewhere a "True Believer" is training to kill you because, unlike Europe , you refuse to submit! He is training with minimal food and water, in austere conditions, training day and night. The only thing clean on him is his weapon. This True Believer is not concerned about "how hard it is. He will not stop in his mission; he knows either he wins or dies and both have great rewards and are acceptable to him.
If he wins, his religious fervor expands. If he dies, he dies with the belief that he is a hero with great rewards awaiting him in Heaven. He doesn't go home at 5 PM; he is at home in his overwhelming religious dedication. He knows only The Cause.
This is the problem Europe faces. Like the woman author quoted above: "it is sometimes better to let yourself be raped than to risk serious injuries while resisting." She continued: "it is sometimes better to avoid fighting than run
the risk of death."
Like the Muslim fighter above, Americans must have something they believe in so strongly they are willing to fight and die for it. Freedom and the lifestyle it provides us have been taken for granted by so many for so long, it will take a radical shift caused by the "True Believer fighters" for us to wakeup!
"
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Old 03-04-2007, 10:32   #20
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Perhaps adding it to Snopes could help a bit?

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Old 03-04-2007, 12:18   #21
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NDD,

I borrowed it as my signature for another site, but gave you credit. It was too good not to.

GD
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Old 03-04-2007, 17:00   #22
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While I've no doubt that some of those are, in fact, examples of plagiarism, this sentiment is not an uncommon one. I remember shortly after coming to this forum exchanging PMs with NDD about a version I'd seen on a t-shirt sev'l years ago that read, to the best of my recollection, "Right now, someone is training to kill you and take what's yours. Still wanna quit?"
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Old 03-04-2007, 17:07   #23
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I remember the conversation. I never saw any such T-shirt.

And Brah, a lot of people have said something similar, but nobody has ever been able to point us in the right direction.
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Somewhere a True Believer is training to kill you. He is training with minimal food or water, in austere conditions, training day and night. The only thing clean on him is his weapon and he made his web gear. He doesn't worry about what workout to do - his ruck weighs what it weighs, his runs end when the enemy stops chasing him. This True Believer is not concerned about 'how hard it is;' he knows either he wins or dies. He doesn't go home at 17:00, he is home.
He knows only The Cause.

Still want to quit?
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Old 03-17-2007, 11:02   #24
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Ahhh! Meant to respond to this before and forgot.

First, Sneaky, I was not in any way implying that you did come up with the idea entirely on your own. My sincerest apologies if you thought I was casting any sort of aspersion on you integrety.

As per, IIRC, our previous converation on this topic, I think the germ of the notion (what a song writer would call the hook), the "still wanna quit" piece is simple enough and topical enough that it could occur simultaneously to different people, much as very similar sentiments appear on slightly different bumper stickers when an issue looms large in the public consciousness.

The "True Believer" component was not something I'd ever seen before your quote, and the nature of that (e.g., the G making his own web gear) reflects your specific background, training, and outlook, so that it is exceedingly unlikely that someone else would come up with the same sort or language. However, as plagiarism requires a conscious and deliberate stealing of another's ideas or words, it is still quite possible that this hasn't occurred.

Again, given the topicality and interest in terrorism and the relative softness of many in the West, this is the kind of thing that captures the public's imagination and gets repeated, generally without attribution, evolving slightly as it is repeated. Things stick in people's consciousness without their recognizing it. (The most famous example may be that of Helen Keller, apparently entirely unknowingly, offering a near perfect copy of a poem that she had heard as a child as her own.)

Dad "busted" me once on an idea that I was using in something I was writing as belonging to an author we'd both read (Lawrence Saunders), I was sure the thought was original, but when I went and checked, Dad was right. In the decade or so since this happened, I have tried to be particularly diligent in never repeating this sin, but have caught myself doing it a couple of times, and I would wager a large sum of money that there've been things I've missed, my best intentions notwithstanding.

Anyway, I apologize again, both for any offense my previous post may have given, and for not addressing this sooner.

I hope there are no ill feelings.

Last edited by Cincinnatus; 03-17-2007 at 11:05.
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Old 03-17-2007, 11:39   #25
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cincinnatus
While I've no doubt that some of those are, in fact, examples of plagiarism, this sentiment is not an uncommon one. I remember shortly after coming to this forum exchanging PMs with NDD about a version I'd seen on a t-shirt sev'l years ago that read, to the best of my recollection, "Right now, someone is training to kill you and take what's yours. Still wanna quit?"
Find it or shut up.

I've done a search and found nothing even close to what you are posting. Unlike some of the other internet "tactical childrens" tabloids-bulletin boards, we will not deal in hearsay, got it?

Find it or shut up. This is not a request.

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Old 05-27-2007, 20:42   #26
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Found another version of the "True Believer" quote in a case study on COIN in Afghanistan circa 2004. It was credited to an "Unknown Source, Ft Bragg, NC." Thought the location was quite interesting.

NDD, now you are being quoted in official Army documents and in one covering a favorite topic no less.

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Old 05-27-2007, 21:06   #27
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I would like to say I am a true believe in the American way. I think many here are. Looking back at history we are not alone nor will be alone in the future. We will prevail too. We will prevail for all the right reasons.

Personally the despots have more to fear from us, than we from them. Their time is numbered. The quality of the men and women in our arm forces today is a testament to that fact.
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Old 05-27-2007, 21:28   #28
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http://mywebpages.comcast.net/guyanh...arytribute.htm
Attributed to a 1SGT from 10th Mountain
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Somewhere a True Believer is training to kill you. He is training with minimal food or water, in austere conditions, training day and night. The only thing clean on him is his weapon and he made his web gear. He doesn't worry about what workout to do - his ruck weighs what it weighs, his runs end when the enemy stops chasing him. This True Believer is not concerned about 'how hard it is;' he knows either he wins or dies. He doesn't go home at 17:00, he is home.
He knows only The Cause.

Still want to quit?
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Old 05-27-2007, 21:46   #29
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If imitation is a great form of flattery, what is plagiarism?
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Old 05-27-2007, 21:47   #30
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Roguish Lawyer
If imitation is a great form of flattery, what is plagiarism?
Illegal
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Somewhere a True Believer is training to kill you. He is training with minimal food or water, in austere conditions, training day and night. The only thing clean on him is his weapon and he made his web gear. He doesn't worry about what workout to do - his ruck weighs what it weighs, his runs end when the enemy stops chasing him. This True Believer is not concerned about 'how hard it is;' he knows either he wins or dies. He doesn't go home at 17:00, he is home.
He knows only The Cause.

Still want to quit?
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