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Old 10-22-2017, 08:53   #16
JJ_BPK
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Originally Posted by Paradude54 View Post
On a somewhat different note, has anyone ever heard of the Q Course being referred to as “A School”? I heard that one the other day and don’t know if it was something really old, pretty new or the guy was full of shit. It was an online comment, so I couldn’t Judge by his age.
In the 60t's and I think into the mid 70t's, JFK-IMA offered a correspondence course. I took it while in C 6th SFG, as the S4. If I remember It took me about 2 months for all the section, after work and weekends, between parties.

Additionally,, the Q was run at-by "The School House", so I suspect "school" was used in context?

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Old 10-22-2017, 09:20   #17
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"A School" - I think the only time I heard that phrase was when a Navy type was talking about some school after boot camp.

Just assumed it referred to an advanced school to get a rating. As to what rating ain't got a clue.
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Old 10-22-2017, 17:06   #18
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Originally Posted by Paradude54 View Post
On a somewhat different note, has anyone ever heard of the Q Course being referred to as “A School”? I heard that one the other day and don’t know if it was something really old, pretty new or the guy was full of shit. It was an online comment, so I couldn’t Judge by his age.
Navy folk use that term and I think the AF also does. Never heard anyone in the army refer to AIT as A School......
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Old 10-24-2017, 14:45   #19
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By 83 there were very few old timers in the line companies of 5th Group.

Sure, there were some old Team Sergeants around but lots of teams had an older Team Sergeant, a couple of junior SFC's and then a bunch of SSGs and SGTs. Most E-4s were promoted shortly after getting to group. We deployed a full 12 man team in 85. Enlisted were 4 SFCs, 3 SSGs, 2 SGTs and a SP4.

Late 70s and early 80s lots of senior Medics, Commo and Engineers went off to leg land to be 1SGs when they came out on the 8 list. If they were lucky and made SGM they might get back and get a company. If not they retired.

Nov 1974 two thirds of our class made PFC on graduation day - I was one of them and reported to 5th Group that afternoon.

I've seen plenty of times a ghost SD somewhere holding down a slot that couldn't be filled. I did have an advantage being on a dive team when dive pay came out. Those slots got filled with divers or we moved them on.
We had a similar issue in the SODs. There were two types of folks in the detachments - SFC/MSG with master wings and CIBs, and buck Sergeants with novice wings. The senior guys had spent their entire careers moving from one SOD to another.

MI Branch would leave them alone until they made E8. When that happened they became fair game for a 1SG job somewhere else. Not many of them made it back into the SODs after that. Each det had 2 MSG and a SGM position so there wasn't much room. While I was there they combined the SOD with the Group MI Det so the senior slots got even thinner after that.
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Old 11-01-2017, 14:47   #20
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Graduated in '93 and was told all graduates are automatically promoted to E-5 if not already an NCO. I was an E-4, never went to an E-5 board, and was invited to my E-6 board one morning while in language school in my PTs to confirm my name.
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Old 11-01-2017, 16:07   #21
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There’s a current memorandum that states any E5 with 42 months time in service and six months time in grade receives an automatic promotion to E6 Applicable to all 18-series and I believe 37 and or 35 series.

For FNGs like myself, I was 18X but met the requirement due to length of the 18D course and was promoted first of the next month after grad about 10 days later as was the same for a few other X-ray 18Ds I know that didn’t go straight through.
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Old 11-02-2017, 09:16   #22
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Graduated in '93 and was told all graduates are automatically promoted to E-5 if not already an NCO. I was an E-4, never went to an E-5 board, and was invited to my E-6 board one morning while in language school in my PTs to confirm my name.
I remember when you made six and a certain cocky 18B was pissed that you out ranked him
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Old 11-02-2017, 10:47   #23
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I remember when you made six and a certain cocky 18B was pissed that you out ranked him

I forgot about Jim. He and I didn't get along during Sage either. Wonder what happened after he was kicked off island? Anyway, as a 18B he went to selection while I was already in the Q so no sympathy on that count. I also seem to remember 18D E-6 points were always minimum, not the case with B and C at the time. Remember my E6 party? Fastest drunk I ever had, though I remember Sssteve took all the spare booze home.

Oh yea, forgot to apologize again for the boxer's fracture "incident". I'd never seen one and wanted to rule out a dislocation. I know it hurt but you took my attempts to reduce it like a man so kudos!

Last edited by spottedmedic111; 11-02-2017 at 10:52.
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Old 11-02-2017, 16:16   #24
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I forgot about Jim. He and I didn't get along during Sage either. Wonder what happened after he was kicked off island? Anyway, as a 18B he went to selection while I was already in the Q so no sympathy on that count. I also seem to remember 18D E-6 points were always minimum, not the case with B and C at the time. Remember my E6 party? Fastest drunk I ever had, though I remember Sssteve took all the spare booze home.

Oh yea, forgot to apologize again for the boxer's fracture "incident". I'd never seen one and wanted to rule out a dislocation. I know it hurt but you took my attempts to reduce it like a man so kudos!
Good times. Brother.
Certainly wasn't my last broken knuckle.
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Old 11-03-2017, 08:05   #25
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Things Changed Quick

Quote:
Originally Posted by Pete View Post
By 83 there were very few old timers in the line companies of 5th Group.

Sure, there were some old Team Sergeants around but lots of teams had an older Team Sergeant, a couple of junior SFC's and then a bunch of SSGs and SGTs. Most E-4s were promoted shortly after getting to group. We deployed a full 12 man team in 85. Enlisted were 4 SFCs, 3 SSGs, 2 SGTs and a SP4.

Late 70s and early 80s lots of senior Medics, Commo and Engineers went off to leg land to be 1SGs when they came out on the 8 list. If they were lucky and made SGM they might get back and get a company. If not they retired.

Nov 1974 two thirds of our class made PFC on graduation day - I was one of them and reported to 5th Group that afternoon.

I've seen plenty of times a ghost SD somewhere holding down a slot that couldn't be filled. I did have an advantage being on a dive team when dive pay came out. Those slots got filled with divers or we moved them on.
In 1970, SF started the practice of automatically promoting to E-5 upon graduation. Problem was, us guys who had graduated in the previous few months weren't grandfathered in, so there were a bunch of pissed off E-4's for about a year since there were no E-5 slots opening up now.
So Pete, it sounds like between 70 and 74, SF changed again? Wow.
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Old 11-04-2017, 18:00   #26
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Originally Posted by Premsore View Post
In 1970, SF started the practice of automatically promoting to E-5 upon graduation. Problem was, us guys who had graduated in the previous few months weren't grandfathered in, so there were a bunch of pissed off E-4's for about a year since there were no E-5 slots opening up now.
So Pete, it sounds like between 70 and 74, SF changed again? Wow.
I graduated in 1970 just in the nick of time to get an E-5 promotion. I thought, "Damn, that was quick and easy."
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Old 11-05-2017, 09:11   #27
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Originally Posted by Premsore View Post
In 1970, SF started the practice of automatically promoting to E-5 upon graduation. Problem was, us guys who had graduated in the previous few months weren't grandfathered in, so there were a bunch of pissed off E-4's for about a year since there were no E-5 slots opening up now.
So Pete, it sounds like between 70 and 74, SF changed again? Wow.
My promotion to E-5 was not automatic upon SFQC graduation in 1983. I went to a promotion board of all SF SGM's in between phase one and phase two.

Never forget when one of them asked me to find the terrain feature located at xy-xy on the map. I said there is a body of water there, next question was, "How deep it that lake? asked the SGM with a deadpan face. I smiled and replied, "I don't have a clue SGM." He almost started laughing out loud.
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Old 11-05-2017, 10:58   #28
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I was on a SF contract after enlisting in 83'. Came in as a PFC due to 4 yrs JROTC and got my Spec4 while recovering from a broken leg jumping into Robin Sage. Got CPL few months later and then went to the E5 board few months after I got to group. Turned 20 yrs old while in pre SCUBA and pinned SGT on after getting back from Key West.

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Old 11-05-2017, 15:44   #29
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At SFQC in 1980, I remember a few E3(P) & E4(P) students in my class. Mostly from Reserve or Guard Groups. IIRC, the procedure back then was to automatically promote to the next rank as soon as Army minimums were met (Time in Service, Time in Grade). They started retroactively pencil whipping SFQC credit for PLDC/BNCOC completion back in the mid-1980s (or whatever the Army called those courses back then). I never attended a formal away NCO course until SF ANCOC. Ranger School & SFQC covered the earlier levels back at that time.

I arrived at my first ODA as an E-5 (but I had already made that rank at 2/75). Slotted into an E-7 Heavy (Sr) Weapons slot. Went to E6 board just as soon as I was eligible. Got promoted the next month.

I was actually thrown out of my 1-10 SFG(A) E-6 Board by newly arrived CSM Arthur Garcia. He had arrive the night before and decided to use the next morning's Monthly NCO Board as an example of his...style. As the only E-5 up for E-6 that month, I was first in the bucket. Entered the room, pirouetted through a couple of facing movements, and had my ass scorched for supposed uniform deficiencies. Back out in the hallway after less than a minute...with my tail feathers smoking. Which worried all of the E-4s sitting out there greatly. Because I actually looked pretty sharp in my Greens. Better than them. LOL.

After some kind of internal E9 voodoo discussion, I got called back in by my Company SGM and reported to the President of the Board a second time. Max points awarded and no further drama.

I never actually encountered a live E-4 on an AD ODA. The lowest rank I ever saw assigned was E-5. 1980-2012.

As a Company SGM circa 2009/2010, every newly assigned SFQC grad I received was at least an E5. Most of them were combat experienced E5/E6 NCOs from previous conventional assignments. A few cherry E-5 X-Rays.

Last edited by Astronomy; 11-05-2017 at 19:12.
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Old 11-06-2017, 20:56   #30
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I never actually encountered a live E-4 on an AD ODA. The lowest rank I ever saw assigned was E-5. 1980-2012.
Well, we used to pin the rank on before the actual promotion. So there were some E-4's on our teams.



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