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Old 06-13-2018, 17:50   #61
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I for one am not a believer in man evolving from chimps or mermaids or anything else of such extreme when talking evolution. I believe in creation and evolution of man from that creation which is being shown through science as being more complex than man can really understand yet....I do not believe that science is anti faith it reinforces the great complexity and power we were spawned from. Being around my own father in law and his colleagues I found that they spoke of their faith in what they have learned as something so far beyond mans understanding that they realized the more they discovered in science the more humbled they became knowing how little they know and in fact collectively the great intellectual minds and research of scientist combined together cannot adequately explain with certainty the mystery of life.

I feel that biblical purist have an unreasonable expectation of man being created out of thin air a mere 4-5000 yrs ago despite the evidence of fossils and skeletal remains far predating the time frame they discuss in church every Sunday and have even heard these same otherwise intelligent people try to say all these things are of the devil to destroy mans faith and obedience. Simplistic stories such as Adam and Eve that reflects in a way the same story of creation of carbon based organisms and evolution of genetics as man spread about the earth to different climates and developed their own languages which reflects the genesis story of the tower of Babyl in the destruction and confounding of tongues as man was prevented from reaching heaven the similarities in the story and what happened according to science are remarkable considering the stories of the Genesis of man was not recorded until 700+- A.D. and prior to that were stories maintained by the tribe historian through memory and oration over a campfire like the African tribes still do. And the fascinating history of nearly every culture has a similar version of mankind and a supreme entity or entities with variations long before man ever interacted after a majority of evolution had found us segregated geographically, racially, linguistically......

Maybe leftists should start looking at the factors that connect all of us instead of trying to continue to play the modern version of babylon where they confound us on racial, social, economics, religion etc.....instead of language

No idea where you got this but ok. I'll go back to making blood sacrifices and throwing the bones.
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Old 06-13-2018, 20:52   #62
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No idea where you got this but ok. I'll go back to making blood sacrifices and throwing the bones.
On the complexity I got it from scientist who worked in the field of genetics my father in law being one... brilliant guys who admit they stood on the shoulders of other scientist and in turn watching the torch of their furthering the understanding being advanced and what they thought they knew being disproven and confirmed. Creation belief is a personal choice to accept follow your own way brother no judgments from me lol I could care less if you danced naked around fires drinking fire water chanting to the gun gods but if they can prove that we evolved from apes then I would accept the science to a degree.
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Old 06-13-2018, 22:48   #63
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On the complexity I got it from scientist who worked in the field of genetics my father in law being one... brilliant guys who admit they stood on the shoulders of other scientist and in turn watching the torch of their furthering the understanding being advanced and what they thought they knew being disproven and confirmed. Creation belief is a personal choice to accept follow your own way brother no judgments from me lol I could care less if you danced naked around fires drinking fire water chanting to the gun gods but if they can prove that we evolved from apes then I would accept the science to a degree.
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Old 06-14-2018, 10:56   #64
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On the complexity I got it from scientist who worked in the field of genetics my father in law being one... brilliant guys who admit they stood on the shoulders of other scientist and in turn watching the torch of their furthering the understanding being advanced and what they thought they knew being disproven and confirmed. Creation belief is a personal choice to accept follow your own way brother no judgments from me lol I could care less if you danced naked around fires drinking fire water chanting to the gun gods but if they can prove that we evolved from apes then I would accept the science to a degree.
Complexity is being broken down every day. What was complex 100 years ago is now science fact. And that, just like evolution will continue to march on.

It's still a free country and you can believe in anything you desire.

Hundreds of Millions used to believe Uri Geller could actually move things with his mind, he even fooled "scientists", but didn't fool the real magicians.

Now if you'll excuse me I have to help to dismember a body for a "Sky Burial". (I told them a Viking Boat Burial was much easier and less messy.)
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Old 02-01-2019, 19:38   #65
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The military has required servicemember DNA samples since the early 1990s.

Allegedly for identification of otherwise unknown remains, many resisted the requirement, suspecting that it would be data for Big Brother to use for any purpose he deemed necessary.

That suspicion has subsequently proven to be correct.

TR
Speaking of suspicion:

Family Tree DNA discloses it’s been working with the FBI:

https://www.buzzfeednews.com/article...ealogy-privacy
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Old 02-01-2019, 20:19   #66
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The Iceland Experiment

The drug company Roche of Switzerland embarked on DNA testing of the Poulation in Iceland some years back. Several ethical delemas came up and continue to arise.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.the...arch-31435/amp
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Old 02-03-2019, 17:47   #67
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FtDNA sent this out today.

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Dear Customers:

I am writing to address the news that our Gene-by-Gene laboratory, which processes genetic tests for several commercial clients in addition to all of the FamilyTreeDNA tests, has processed a handful of DNA samples for cold cases from the F.B.I. In many cases, the news reports contained false or misleading information.

Let me start with this categorical statement:

LAW ENFORCEMENT DOES NOT HAVE OPEN ACCESS TO THE FTDNA DATABASE.

They cannot search or “dig through” FTDNA profiles any more than an ordinary user can. As with all other genetic genealogy services, law enforcement must provide valid legal process, such as a subpoena or search warrant to receive any information beyond that which any other user can access.

I have been an avid genealogist since I was twelve years old. FamilyTreeDNA is not just a business, it is my passion. I fully understand your privacy concerns on a personal level.

Law enforcement has the ability to test DNA samples from crime scenes and upload the results into databases, like any other customer can, and it appears they have been doing it at other companies for the past year. The distinction is that, according to our Terms of Service and Privacy Policy, we expect the FBI and law enforcement agencies to let us know when they submit something to our database. We moved to something transparent, rather than having them work in a stealthy way. Other than that, nothing changed that affects the privacy of our customers.

FamilyTreeDNA has always taken your privacy seriously and will continue to do so. We’ve remained steadfast, always, refusing to sell your data to pharmaceutical companies and other third parties.

One of the key reasons law enforcement wanted to submit their samples to us is the same reason many of you have: out of all the major companies, FamilyTreeDNA is the only one that has its own lab, and our customers’ samples never leave our company.

As previously stated, law enforcement can only receive information beyond that which is accessible to the standard user by providing FamilyTreeDNA with valid legal process, such as a subpoena or a search warrant. Again, this is specified in FamilyTreeDNA’s Terms of Service, just as with all other companies.

ABOUT OUR TERMS OF SERVICE

The Terms of Service were changed in May of 2018 to reflect GDPR requirements, and we informed our customers about the update at that time. Those changes included a paragraph that required law enforcement to receive our permission to enter the database and since it was a part of the overall update, notice was sent to every FTDNA customer. Without infringing upon our customers’ privacy, the language in the paragraph referring to law enforcement was updated in December, although nothing changed in the actual handling of such requests. It was an oversight that notice of the revision was not sent to you and that is our mistake. Therefore, we are reverting our TOS to our May 2018 version, and any future changes will be communicated to you in a timely manner.

This is the May 2018, GDPR-compliant version, communicated to you at that time: “You agree to not use the Services for any law enforcement purposes, forensic examinations, criminal investigations, and/or similar purposes without the required legal documentation and written permission from FamilyTreeDNA.”

WE WILL DO A BETTER JOB OF COMMUNICATING WITH YOU.

I am genuinely sorry for not having handled our communications with you as we should have.

We’ve received an incredible amount of support from those of you who believe this is an opportunity for honest, law-abiding citizens to help catch bad guys and bring closure to devastated families. We want you to understand, as many of you already do, that you have the same protections that you’ve always had and that you have nothing to fear.

We’ve also heard from supporters offering ideas and solutions to make the FamilyTreeDNA experience a more comfortable one in light of this new information.

We are listening. Our plan is to create a panel of citizen genealogist advisors who will work with us as we focus on how to make your FamilyTreeDNA experience the best one available.

Sincerely,

Bennett Greenspan
President
FamilyTreeDNA.com

“History Unearthed Daily"
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Old 02-03-2019, 18:24   #68
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If you haven't been thru the process,, It's very easy.

When you purchase the test kit, spit, and return it, it is processed and out "spits" several hundred records.

ALL normal DNA testing produce the results in pretty much the same format. I think there are a couple, but the effect is the results is "packaged" the same.

Here is were the LEOs jump in, buy a kit, register the super decoder ID, submit results,,, from the LEO labs in the standard format.

Then the host service crunches the data and matches it to their database. After a bit, they send you an email to come view your data and possible relative list.

In my case, there are 1032 people that are close, based on the probability of the fact that we shared like 3.5% OR LESS DNA. I suspect the LEO's did better?

23andMe has an option whereby you can share and contact your cuz, if they agree.

For the LEOs (pick a number) if they get a 40% hit, it's time for a warrant.


Here is the top of my cuz list sorted by "strength". My screen does show about 1/2 with names or initials, but I can only use their system to attempt contact. To date I haven't tried because the linkage is weak.

2nd picture is how a 2nd cuz plots out.
Attached Images
File Type: jpg dna cuz.jpg (32.6 KB, 21 views)
File Type: jpg dna cuz2.jpg (19.0 KB, 19 views)
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Old 02-03-2019, 19:14   #69
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If you haven't been thru the process,, It's very easy.

When you purchase the test kit, spit, and return it, it is processed and out "spits" several hundred records.

ALL normal DNA testing produce the results in pretty much the same format. I think there are a couple, but the effect is the results is "packaged" the same.

Here is were the LEOs jump in, buy a kit, register the super decoder ID, submit results,,, from the LEO labs in the standard format.

Then the host service crunches the data and matches it to their database. After a bit, they send you an email to come view your data and possible relative list.

In my case, there are 1032 people that are close, based on the probability of the fact that we shared like 3.5% OR LESS DNA. I suspect the LEO's did better?

23andMe has an option whereby you can share and contact your cuz, if they agree.

For the LEOs (pick a number) if they get a 40% hit, it's time for a warrant.


Here is the top of my cuz list sorted by "strength". My screen does show about 1/2 with names or initials, but I can only use their system to attempt contact. To date I haven't tried because the linkage is weak.

2nd picture is how a 2nd cuz plots out.

At least once a year someone contacts me wanting to know how we or a kit I manage are related, and they generally want to know who their parent of parents are. All it takes to get started is a detailed and accurate tree. For those that share their results, I can figure out which part of the family they are from in 10-15 minutes. To dig deeper the Ancestry data base, Family Search, Facebook, Newspapers.com and GeneaolgyBank always provide the final pieces to the puzzle.
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Old 02-03-2019, 22:24   #70
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23andMe has an option whereby you can share and contact your cuz, if they agree.
Our son did 23andMe and it shook a cousin out of the tree. It turns out that the uncle whose Silver Star citation I have been researching had a daughter that he didn't know about. Her daughter, my uncle's granddaughter, contacted my son and, recently, me. In her case, she was proud of his history. Be careful, though, if you shake the tree too hard you may be surprised by what nuts drop out.
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Old 02-04-2019, 06:14   #71
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Our son did 23andMe and it shook a cousin out of the tree. It turns out that the uncle whose Silver Star citation I have been researching had a daughter that he didn't know about. Her daughter, my uncle's granddaughter, contacted my son and, recently, me. In her case, she was proud of his history. Be careful, though, if you shake the tree too hard you may be surprised by what nuts drop out.
Might you have the % of like genes for that cousin match? I'm interested as the best I have is 3.5% and wondering if that is the norm for 2-3 cousins?
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Old 02-04-2019, 06:41   #72
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FtDNA sent this out today.
Nice letter. 'Cause we know the FBI would never misrepresent anything to a judge in order to obtain a warrant.
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Old 02-04-2019, 07:01   #73
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23&me has a bubble chart in there showing the relationship in the match.

Daughter is all into filling out everything and she got a hit and the other person made contact with her. She is is the descendant of my Great Grandfather's brother.

IIRC the hit was about 2.5%.
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Old 02-04-2019, 11:08   #74
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Might you have the % of like genes for that cousin match? I'm interested as the best I have is 3.5% and wondering if that is the norm for 2-3 cousins?
I was mistaken, he used Ancestry not 23andMe. They didn't give percentages, just confidence levels. His, as a 2nd cousin, was "Extremely Confident."

I'll PM you the backstory.
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Old 02-05-2019, 08:14   #75
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Nice letter. 'Cause we know the FBI would never misrepresent anything to a judge in order to obtain a warrant.

This is true, and companies never mis-represent or break their own privacy guidelines. I seem to recall many years ago AT&T and others denying they were assisting the .GOV in collecting phone data.

Marketing to general population wise FtDNA is probably on the lower tier of the totem pole, it's just blaaaaah in comparison to AncestryDNA, it's just not fun. So FtDNA must generate income by other means and that might mean partnering with the Feds.

As this DNA collection stuff continues to evolve there is going to be a lot good and bad. A few of the negatives will be government intrusion, DNA based insurance, DNA base reperations and male neutering. One of the major positives could be preventative medicine.
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