Professional Soldiers

Professional Soldiers (http://www.professionalsoldiers.com/forums/index.php)
-   18A (http://www.professionalsoldiers.com/forums/forumdisplay.php?f=77)
-   -   Officer branch prior to 18A (http://www.professionalsoldiers.com/forums/showthread.php?t=32834)

Derek808 03-22-2011 19:32

Officer branch prior to 18A
 
Out of curiosity, while I've searched these boards and I know that an officer's former MOS branch doesn't effect their SFAS eligibility, have any of you gentlemen personally met or known any 18A's who weren't former combat arms officers? (MI, Chem. Ord., MP, etc?)

Thank you.

blue02hd 03-22-2011 19:50

Yes.

Richard 03-22-2011 19:52

Many.

Richard
:munchin

wet dog 03-22-2011 19:54

Quote:

Originally Posted by Derek808 (Post 382739)
Out of curiosity, while I've searched these boards and I know that an officer's former MOS branch doesn't effect their SFAS eligibility, have any of you gentlemen personally met or known any 18A's who weren't former combat arms officers? (MI, Chem. Ord., MP, etc?)

Thank you.

Derek808,

Before many 18A's begin to assist you in adjusting fire, allow me, a Sr NCO to correct this deficiency.

Stop Posting.

There are many threads to read, 1000's of posts, and a few PM's that will be much more beneficial than starting another thread.

If you would like a further explanation, I would be happy to give you a required reading list of threads that will help, or you can wait for others to chime in.

Good luck, welcome to PS.com, have a very SF day.

Derek808 03-22-2011 19:58

Wet Dog,

that would be very helpful to see that thread list, if it's not too much of an inconvenience! And I'll make this my last thread, and instead opt for PM's or replies on threads already up in the future. Didn't mean to add to the clutter!

wet dog 03-22-2011 21:25

Quote:

Originally Posted by Derek808 (Post 382750)
Wet Dog,

that would be very helpful to see that thread list, if it's not too much of an inconvenience! And I'll make this my last thread, and instead opt for PM's or replies on threads already up in the future. Didn't mean to add to the clutter!

Derek -

SF instructions, like most military career paths begin with LOI, POI, etc.

From here, start with the PS.com home page, Forum 18A. Listed are two full pages of 18A information, resulting in 54 different threads, and accompanying posts.

Once finshed, send me a PM, I'll take you through OSS History, followed by each of the 18 series MOS of the men you will command, then PSYOPs, CA, MI, and other branches that support SF and unit organizations that we support in return.

Visit and read TAPS, each of the men, their bios and accompanying posts. Split your time evenly 80/20 between required reading and the balance with reading current affairs, as to not just become a book worm, but someone who will have an intelligent opinion that can defend or argue his point of view.

Find a few heros, like Col Bob Howard and Nick Rowe, what they did, who they were. Then begin making quiet inquiries with some of the men who served with them. Those who knew them are here at PS.com.

Derek, thank you for taking the challenge. This will be an adventure for you, consider also, keeping a journal under your own pen and efforts of lessons learned during this process.

Once you enter the 18A pipeline, Officer Advance Cources and such, the journal will be a wonderful resource as your career progresses.

Good reading, happy hunting, enjoy.

Wet Dog

wet dog 04-09-2011 19:59

Bump
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by wet dog (Post 382768)
Derek -

SF instructions, like most military career paths begin with LOI, POI, etc.

From here, start with the PS.com home page, Forum 18A. Listed are two full pages of 18A information, resulting in 54 different threads, and accompanying posts.

Once finshed, send me a PM, I'll take you through OSS History, followed by each of the 18 series MOS of the men you will command, then PSYOPs, CA, MI, and other branches that support SF and unit organizations that we support in return.

Visit and read TAPS, each of the men, their bios and accompanying posts. Split your time evenly 80/20 between required reading and the balance with reading current affairs, as to not just become a book worm, but someone who will have an intelligent opinion that can defend or argue his point of view.

Find a few heros, like Col Bob Howard and Nick Rowe, what they did, who they were. Then begin making quiet inquiries with some of the men who served with them. Those who knew them are here at PS.com.

Derek, thank you for taking the challenge. This will be an adventure for you, consider also, keeping a journal under your own pen and efforts of lessons learned during this process.

Once you enter the 18A pipeline, Officer Advance Cources and such, the journal will be a wonderful resource as your career progresses.

Good reading, happy hunting, enjoy.

Wet Dog

A few PM'd me back a few weeks ago accepting the challenge.

What have you learned?

Time to chime in, you know who you are.

WD

CW1287 04-11-2011 04:06

Challenge
 
Wet Dog,

I learned quite a few things. One of the first things is that while you may be the Officer of the team you are still a guest of the team. The team will be there after you leave and it was there prior to your arrival. Your mere existance on the team does not make the team succed or fail. The next thing I learned, You are the face of the team to the command. You stick up for the team and take care of the team. If higher is sending down lashes for the team you take them and turn the other cheek for more. This is what is expected of you, you do not dime your men out or lay the blame off on someone else, you man up and shoulder the burden.

The next piece is leadership. There are all different kinds of leaders, some are good and others are poor. The best leaders are those who can take constructive criticism and use it to better themselves. Those who try and do everything on their own without the input of the team will fail and may be seen as a poor leader.

After reading Basenshukai's articles I have learned that flexibilty is a must from a leader. No two situations will ever be the same and a good officer must be able to adapt and overcome. Never quitting is another theme throughout his article, no matter how hopeless a situation (whether it be in training or the "real world") may seem. Sitiational Awareness is keep, if you do not have it you will fail at many junctures. Know it, use it, love it.

I have learned so many things by reading all the posts that I could write an extremely long thread about it. The above seems to be many of the recurring themes I saw. The biggest and most influencial is focus. Keeping focused on the 5M and 25M targets. When you want to achieve something so badly you begin looking out to the 300m and beyond targets. You loose your SA and you miss what is in front of you. In order to achieve everything you want in life you must slow down, know what your 300m target looks like, but focus on the 5M and 25M target, while you work you way out. Not clearing your 5 and 25 could kill your progress (literally in some cases) before you ever get close to your goal. Keep your SA in check.

LT W

Wet Dog, if you are looking for more let me know and I add to my message.

1stindoor 04-11-2011 06:41

Good job LT. That's the way to answer a challenge. You'll find that those lessons will serve you well in any career field.

Richard 04-11-2011 07:12

GEN Stan McChrystal: Listen, Learn...Then Lead.

http://www.ted.com/talks/lang/eng/st...cchrystal.html

Richard :munchin

LongWire 04-11-2011 07:58

Thanks for the llnk Richard!!!!!

wet dog 04-17-2011 15:37

LT W
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by CW1287 (Post 386082)
I have learned so many things by reading all the posts that I could write an extremely long thread about it.

LT W

I think you should, make the effort to manage it also, creating chapters, sub threads, keeping those on point and answering the tough questions.

By the way, good job.

WD

CW1287 04-18-2011 03:13

Wet Dog,

I will begin to compile all my lessons learned and thoughts on what I have read and learned. I will PM you once I have finished them, it may be a while before I have it all complete. Once you have reviewed it and given any guidance I will post it in the appropriate areas.

LT W

wet dog 04-18-2011 22:42

A Play Ground Lesson on Life (and an early lesson of leadership)
 
Little Peter Jenkins was not bullied, nor his friends not like him, in fact, he was well liked my most kids in his 5th grade class, and also by the older 6th and 7th graders too. His older brother John, was a star basketball, football and baseball player in the much more experienced 9th grade. Peter had talent, he was just small, but Peter’s real problem was he was always picked last to join a game of kickball for the 3rd period recess, and the long break before the lunch hour and the 30 minute break before biology later in the day.

So Peter devised a plan.

When two of the bigger, stronger, more adapt school boys broke out for the daily kickball game and summarily began to pick players, Peter decided to throw a wrench into the well lubricated machinery that is evident by the predictable behavior of most 5th grade boys at school.

What Peter did, shocked everyone – he opted out of the last position and made a position for himself. He did this not selfishly, but by careful design with goals and rewards for all those who also chose to follow Peter down the long line of “selection”.

What Peter did was announce the “third option”. He announced his intentions to create a new team, drafting the best players to attend a selection course, “try outs” to determine who would be on the team, rather than wait for the coin toss on who was going to begin the drafting sequence. Peter felt the institutional traditions of the campus withheld raw talent from stepping forward. Something had to give, and Peter saw an opportunity.

“Hey fellas, I’m not playing kickball today. Starting Monday, I’ll be conducting a series of tests to see who the fastest runners, the strongest kickers are and most adapt at catching high kicked balls to the infield and outfield.

Candidates selected to join the team, 8 positions open, will be invited to a team house meeting to receive further instructions and receive their benefit and compensation packets for participating in the “selection” process and also an invitation to be part of the “new team”.

Monday morning was anticipated with much excitement. Boys all over the neighborhood practiced all weekend long for the upcoming “selection” event. Throws, kicks, runs, stopping, base stealing, nothing was missed. Everyone waited for Peter’s arrival at the first recess of the morning. By late afternoon, Peter had the matrix of all players in his school, from all ages, 5th grade thru the 8th.

Tuesday morning, Peter made an announcement.

“Friends, by careful review of the “selection” process conducted yesterday afternoon. Eight names have been selected to join the new “Third Option Team”. This team will compete against all other teams including our Junior High School neighbors.

Benefits for being on the team are. 1., Designer posters hung in the school cafeteria, made by the Art department. 2., A team photograph hung in the school admin office. 3., Weekly game announcements conducted by Ms. Tanaka, 6th grade math teacher at the end of every Friday lunch hour. 4., Home Economics instructors have committed school resources to make matching team uniforms. And finally, a dedicated team meeting area and dedicated lunch table in the cafeteria for all team players close to the dessert line. Larger lunch servings are expected, final size to be negotiated with school cafeteria management.

I, as your team leader and manager will no longer be able to perform the functions of team player. I will no longer be able to dedicate the time required to perform at the level of perfection, but my involvement will be to see to team needs and resources. My older brother John will be the team coach and principle trainer.

We all know Scott from Mr. Johnson’s class. Scott has always performed well as a kicker. What Scott needed was consistency, he was always being picked one day by one person, another day by someone else. Scott came to me, requesting the opportunity to play for the “Third Option”. What I told Scott was he had the skills required to play for the team, but it would require more of him than any other player. What the team would require of Scott would be for him to serve as its first Team Captain and responsible for setting team standards of performance and behavior on campus.

This announcement of Scott being the very first Team Captain is a historical event.

All in favor in showing support to Scott as your new All Grade - Ponderosa Elementary School Kickball Team, please say, YES!”

“YES” shouts the entire school cafeteria.

“Scott, would you please step forward and announce the remaining 7 players”.

-----------------------BT------------------------

What lessons can we learn from Peter’s experience?

MTN Medic 04-19-2011 06:28

Quote:

Originally Posted by CW1287 (Post 386082)
Wet Dog,

I learned quite a few things. One of the first things is that while you may be the Officer of the team you are still a guest of the team. The team will be there after you leave and it was there prior to your arrival. Your mere existance on the team does not make the team succed or fail. The next thing I learned, You are the face of the team to the command. You stick up for the team and take care of the team. If higher is sending down lashes for the team you take them and turn the other cheek for more. This is what is expected of you, you do not dime your men out or lay the blame off on someone else, you man up and shoulder the burden.

The next piece is leadership. There are all different kinds of leaders, some are good and others are poor. The best leaders are those who can take constructive criticism and use it to better themselves. Those who try and do everything on their own without the input of the team will fail and may be seen as a poor leader.

After reading Basenshukai's articles I have learned that flexibilty is a must from a leader. No two situations will ever be the same and a good officer must be able to adapt and overcome. Never quitting is another theme throughout his article, no matter how hopeless a situation (whether it be in training or the "real world") may seem. Sitiational Awareness is keep, if you do not have it you will fail at many junctures. Know it, use it, love it.

I have learned so many things by reading all the posts that I could write an extremely long thread about it. The above seems to be many of the recurring themes I saw. The biggest and most influencial is focus. Keeping focused on the 5M and 25M targets. When you want to achieve something so badly you begin looking out to the 300m and beyond targets. You loose your SA and you miss what is in front of you. In order to achieve everything you want in life you must slow down, know what your 300m target looks like, but focus on the 5M and 25M target, while you work you way out. Not clearing your 5 and 25 could kill your progress (literally in some cases) before you ever get close to your goal. Keep your SA in check.

LT W

Wet Dog, if you are looking for more let me know and I add to my message.

Sir, live by that, and you will go far.

CW1287 04-19-2011 07:44

A Play Ground Lesson on Life (and an early lesson of leadership)
 
Wet Dog,

This is in order of how I looked at it not in the order of the story.

First an Officer (or any Special Forces Soldier) must be able to think outside the box. There are always more than two options, you must be able to think abstractly to see the "third option" at times. With this comes flexibility. An Officer must not be static and must be able to more with the flow an adapt as the situation calls for it.

Just because a soldier is the strongest or biggest does not mean they are the best at the particular task at hand. A soldier must be well rounded. In a sense they must be a "jack of all trades" or the "complete package" in all areas while still maintaining excellence in their primary trade.

An Officer (Peter in this case) must place the team before themselves. In this case Peter put the team together to take on other schools, he did not create the team for his own personal gain. Once the team was created he not place himself on the roster.

With the last paragraph, the Officer must place himself in a position to take care of the needs of the team, supervising to make sure the team is on track, but making sure the needs are provided for. Peter in this case made sure the team had the best of everything, such as lunches.

Reward the team for their hardwork. Making sure the team gets the credit THEY are due not taking the credit for yourself. If there is negative credit, you as the leader take blame for the short coming and drive on, you protect the team at all costs.

Make sure the team sergeant and team is set up for success. In this story Peter chose Scott to be the team leader and set the standard and example for all others. As a good leader you must make sure the team sergeant is upholding and enforcing the standards of the team. After reading through all the treads I am sure this is not an issue....:D.

Ultimately the most important is being a team player. Everything that Peter (or an Officer) does is for the benefit of the team. Knowing that the team drives success means making sure everything is done to make the team the best trained, equiped and proficient as possible, with all/any resources if possible.

This is what I got out of this.

LT W

CW1287 04-19-2011 07:53

1stindoor, MTN Medic, Wet Dog,

I will continue living by these lesson and hopefully someday I will have the opportunity to lead, work and and be a guest of a team made of quality soldiers like yourself and other QPs. Until I get to the that point I will continue learning from all the great threads on this site (and from the poor ones :)).


LT W

wet dog 04-19-2011 09:54

Peter also got other elements involved, the Admin.office, the art department, economic class as laborers, cafateria staff, etc. Peter also got the local populace, (other students in school) to "unanimously" support Scott by their cheers.

The crowd of students are not competing athletes, but they felt they were on the team. A much larger force became role-players in the team's success. In SF we call those campaigns, (a phase of guerrilla warfare).

Now Scott as an effective team leader should teach and instruct to all team members team development, work load sharing, cross training for different positions in the event someone is hurt or missing at a game.

Peter continues to make opportunities for team advancement, continues to see team training, in short, he creates the cultural.

Bother Peter and Scott will develop differently. Scott will learn to teach and mentor one-on-one, very different from Peter's experience with larger groups, committees, themes, to some level, political - nation building. Peter will instruct Scott. Scott's vision will grow beyond the team with "Cdr's Intent", see his roll in the team's ability to effect change.

Irregardless of position, both Peter and Scott will have to identify mentors and remain coachable to learn.

1stindoor 04-19-2011 10:36

Quote:

Originally Posted by wet dog (Post 387209)
Irregardless of position, both Peter and Scott will have to identify mentors and remain coachable to learn.

And both will need to identify those people that exhibit the skills necessary to succeed them in the future. Work themselves out of a job while ensuring their collective vision is seen to fruition.

Jack Dale 04-19-2011 11:24

Wet Dog, apparently, Peter was the biggest and strongest, even if it was only between the ears.

Richard 04-20-2011 10:43

1 Attachment(s)
Quote:

Originally Posted by wet dog (Post 382749)
...I would be happy to give you a required reading list...

Some of these may also be worth your time. ;) ;)

Richard :munchin

CW1287 04-26-2011 05:05

Richard,

Thank you for the list. The green ones on the right hand side, do those say "A Military History of the Western World"? Just wanted to verify. I have read a few of those, but it is clear I have a few more to begin.

LT W

Utah Bob 04-26-2011 17:35

Quote:

have any of you gentlemen personally met or known any 18A's who weren't former combat arms officers?
Yes.

Richard 04-26-2011 18:40

Quote:

Originally Posted by CW1287 (Post 388372)
The green ones on the right hand side, do those say "A Military History of the Western World"? Just wanted to verify.

Yep - JFC Fuller's classic. I got mine (1st ed) for free at the USIS library at the AmEmbassy-Bonn when they were going to toss them for not having been checked out in years. Sometimes you just get lucky. ;)

Gutes lesen!

Richard :munchin

sleepyhead4 04-26-2011 23:48

LT W,

I have only one thing to add to your list of what an SF Officer should and is expected to do. Do not accept substandard performance or immoral/unethical actions by anyone. Mistakes are made everyday. If they are honest mistakes that can be corrected, then correct it. If they are done intentionally as a flaw in character or out of sheer laziness, that is unacceptable.

Remember, "big boy rules."


All times are GMT -6. The time now is 17:36.


Copyright 2004-2019 by Professional Soldiers